In Discovery's defense, we don't actually have a lot of evidence that the Cage uniforms are actually canon.
There's TONS of junk from The Cage that didn't carry over into actual Trek canon. The uniforms are apparently one of those things, now.
There's TONS of junk from The Cage that didn't carry over into actual Trek canon. The uniforms are apparently one of those things, now.
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In Discovery's defense, we don't actually have a lot of evidence that the Cage uniforms are actually canon.
There's TONS of junk from The Cage that didn't carry over into actual Trek canon. The uniforms are apparently one of those things, now.
In The Cage they use lasers and rockets on their ships. Spock shows huge amounts of emotions. The Federation uses 'Time Warp'. None of these things carried over.
Entire races have changed appearances before, often times with no in-universe explanation- see both the Klingons, Gorn, Andorians, Tellarites and the Trill.
Trek has made major retroactive changes to its own history before, even- sometimes even retconning earlier episodes of the same series! Earlier episodes of TNG imply that the Klingons are not only from a planet named 'Kling', but also longtime members of the Federation!
Star Trek has a history of playing fast and loose with canon to EXACTLY this extent.
Entire races have changed appearances before, often times with no in-universe explanation- see both the Klingons, Gorn, Andorians, Tellarites and the Trill.
Trek has made major retroactive changes to its own history before, even- sometimes even retconning earlier episodes of the same series! Earlier episodes of TNG imply that the Klingons are not only from a planet named 'Kling', but also longtime members of the Federation!
Star Trek has a history of playing fast and loose with canon to EXACTLY this extent.
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Jack, your argument wasn't really persuading me until the Klingons being from Kling and from the Federation. That just...yeah you know what, I'm cool with Discovery changing things. Still would like a source on that if you don't mind.
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http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Klingon_Empire
Memory Alpha wrote:
In the TNG episode "Samaritan Snare", Wesley Crusher asked Captain Picard if an event happened "before the Klingons joined the Federation." This statement has never been explained in canon and later episodes clearly show a Klingon Empire that didn't join the Federation.
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Obviously I've got no evidence for this statement, but I've given the construction differences between the Shenzou and the Discovery, I wonder if the Shenzou is actually an older ship? It cosmetically looks closer to ENT than TOS, which makes me think that it might be something like how the Miranda Class is still in operation, like. Fifty years later?
Alternatively: it's advanced because they wanted to make it look advanced, which isn't really the end of the world. It's a neat design.
Alternatively: it's advanced because they wanted to make it look advanced, which isn't really the end of the world. It's a neat design.
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So, a thought I had re the main Klingon, specifically, his name...
Kermit edit: moved to appropriate thread
Draz edit: oops, you're right, sorry and thanks.
Spoiler: Show
T'Kuvma wanted to reunite the great houses of the Empire.
Who does VOY and STO say will redeem, restore, reunite the two breeds of Klingon? The Kuvah'magh.
Who does VOY and STO say will redeem, restore, reunite the two breeds of Klingon? The Kuvah'magh.
Kermit edit: moved to appropriate thread
Draz edit: oops, you're right, sorry and thanks.
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I'll leave my general thoughts on the first two episodes here.
First episode: Train wreck.
Second episode: Somewhat more redeeming, and the teaser was interesting. Certainly made me want to give the show more time to grow on me.
And to respond to what Jack was saying, No Trek hasn't. A lot of those lines or mentions were practically throw away and can be easily ignored. A WHOLE asthetic change cannot be easily ignored or retconned. As for lasers being retconned by phase pistols, well I'm still mad at Enterprise of that so
First episode: Train wreck.
Second episode: Somewhat more redeeming, and the teaser was interesting. Certainly made me want to give the show more time to grow on me.
And to respond to what Jack was saying, No Trek hasn't. A lot of those lines or mentions were practically throw away and can be easily ignored. A WHOLE asthetic change cannot be easily ignored or retconned. As for lasers being retconned by phase pistols, well I'm still mad at Enterprise of that so
Yeah....... Umm.... I don't like it, but i don't dislike it. I will need to see more before I can make that official judgement
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As others have said, I'm in the middle. I've just watched the first episode, but so far, I feel like the Orville is much more Star Trek than Discovery. If the aesthetics and names of things were changed in the Orville even slightly, then I would sooner say that fit into Trek than Discovery so far has. I'll still give it a shot though.
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oh-and-another-thing:
What is this, treating radiation exposure with anti-protons? They should have been flushing (spoiler)'s system with hyronalin!
*muttergrumble*
What is this, treating radiation exposure with anti-protons? They should have been flushing (spoiler)'s system with hyronalin!
*muttergrumble*
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I generally agree with Osi, but I really like Saru and I haven't had a chance to see Jason Isaacs playing his character yet, so I'm optimistic that even if this isn't the best Trek ever, it will still be good enough to warrant watching.
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Im still willing to give the show another go...but if our main char is vulcan...what she did was VERY illigoical...just sayin...
Im still willing to give the show another go...but if our main char is vulcan...what she did was VERY illigoical...just sayin...
I ment half vulcan..but alright...she still seems very marry sue like..and a utter mess.
Three words: Argo. Penal. Battalion
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here is my prediction for episode three, she is being transported to a Federation Penal Colony, and the Captain sees her ability, strikes a friendship, something happens, she saves the day, and Ro laren her way back into Starfleet as Discovery's new XO.
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Pro: The older house Klingon aesthetic. Beautiful. Elegant. Reminiscent of the Middle East. I'm sure that's not coincidental.
Pro: The Klingons actually speaking Klingon for practically all of their scenes.
Con: The Klingon cranial and facial prosthetics are overkill. The poor actors can hardly shape their face, emote, or speak their lines clearly. I know Klingon is a guttural language, but it was tough to discern the work the actors put in to learn their lines through all the makeup and dental facades.
Pro: The Klingons actually speaking Klingon for practically all of their scenes.
Con: The Klingon cranial and facial prosthetics are overkill. The poor actors can hardly shape their face, emote, or speak their lines clearly. I know Klingon is a guttural language, but it was tough to discern the work the actors put in to learn their lines through all the makeup and dental facades.
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